TouchdownBlue.com
Welcome to Touchdown Blue!

Come join our NY Giants community along with other Great Fans of the Game!

Please take a moment to register for free to discuss NY Giants Football and more.

Your friends @ TouchdownBlue.com
Giants News Alert

Giants News Wire
Training Camp Updates
 

Speculation - what would it take to trade Shockey?

View previous topic View next topic Go down

Speculation - what would it take to trade Shockey?

Post  Big_Pete on Mon Jun 30, 2008 12:08 am

there is plenty of speculation about the possible trading of Jeremy Shockey


Assuming that there is a desire from our front office to trade Shockey provided we can get good value, what sort of deal would it take to get a deal sone?

Teams seem to horde our draft picks and I don't see any major changes in the situation since draft day; so a straight up trade for picks is unlikley unless some team changes their mind about what they wish to offer.

That means for a trade to happen, it will almsot certainly be some kind of player trade, with or without picks.



So I guess the real question is what teams will be interested in aquireing shockey? and what players will they be willing to offer?

There aren't too many positions the giants need; unless something amazing falls into out lap (unlikely), it is most likely going to be defensive (we are pretty set at QB, OL, RB, WR).

Teams which probably have legitimate interest in Shockey:
New Orelans, Tampa Bay, New York Jets, Miami, Oakland, Atlanta, New England, Detroit, Houston and Buffalo

which players on these teams are viable trade options?

from nfl.com

The Giants will trade him in an instant if they get better than the second- and fifth-round pick package that the New Orleans Saints presented earlier this year. Moving that fifth to a fourth would likely do it. Getting a first-round pick and a solid player the Giants like would do it.

and from Vinnie DiTrianni

The rumor had been a very complicated multi-team deal was in the works, one which relied on a lot of things falling into place.
avatar
Big_Pete
Giants Legend
Giants Legend


View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Speculation - what would it take to trade Shockey?

Post  Pizan on Tue Jul 01, 2008 7:57 pm

Shockey's trade value hasn't taken a hit nor are the Giants in a position where they have to trade him... (Although the media does make it seem that way and fans always buy what they sell.) In fact, assuming Shockey can pass a physical his value is better as far as draft picks. For a team like the Saints to get Shockey they need to separate with their 1st round pick. Shockey immediately improves their team making them a legit contender and a late round selection while we have to wait til next year for our return which is a near second round pick.

So if I'm the Giants I don't settle for any less than a first round pick. We don't have to trade Shockey. Period. Shockey is a probowl player one of the best in the league, you don't get antsy and trade that for chump change. As far as a player for Shockey, our roster is pretty much set so a team will really have to offer up an equivalent player other wise it isn't worth it. If its a player and a second, maybe a young S, LB, or DT but really we are fine at those positions. Why create a question mark at TE when the return now is minimal like a 2nd and a 4th for example.
avatar
Pizan
All-Pro
All-Pro


View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Speculation - what would it take to trade Shockey?

Post  Big_Pete on Tue Jul 01, 2008 8:08 pm

Pizan wrote:Shockey's trade value hasn't taken a hit nor are the Giants in a position where they have to trade him... (Although the media does make it seem that way and fans always buy what they sell.) In fact, assuming Shockey can pass a physical his value is better as far as draft picks. For a team like the Saints to get Shockey they need to separate with their 1st round pick. Shockey immediately improves their team making them a legit contender and a late round selection while we have to wait til next year for our return which is a near second round pick.

So if I'm the Giants I don't settle for any less than a first round pick. We don't have to trade Shockey. Period. Shockey is a probowl player one of the best in the league, you don't get antsy and trade that for chump change. As far as a player for Shockey, our roster is pretty much set so a team will really have to offer up an equivalent player other wise it isn't worth it. If its a player and a second, maybe a young S, LB, or DT but really we are fine at those positions. Why create a question mark at TE when the return now is minimal like a 2nd and a 4th for example.

I agree with alot of what your saying

The Giants are not going to trade Shockey unless they get what they consider good value for him.
avatar
Big_Pete
Giants Legend
Giants Legend


View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Speculation - what would it take to trade Shockey?

Post  Big_Pete on Wed Jul 02, 2008 6:39 pm

Not much football happening, so I am going to speculate....

Here is a hypothetical three-way trade idea that I think could get it done:


NY Giants trade Jeremy Shockey to Cincinnati

Chad Johnson is not happy; plus the Bengals need a good TE badly (being the only team in that division without one). The Bengals have a good Oline and Shockey improves both the running game and passing game. This would work extremely well for both Carson Palmer and Jeremy Shockey. Shockey's passion and competitiveness will be a big positive for the Bengals locker room without the legal issues that the Bengals have had in recent past. Shockey is also quite cheap (very important for a notoriously frugal owner).


Cincinnati trades Chad Johnson to San Diego

Chad Johnson wants out in a big way. While things may be able to be patched on the surface in the short term, this a ticking bomb waiting to explode; if it does go off there will be a meltdown and the Bengals football will suffer. San Diego really need a top quality WR to take their offense to the next level. They have the franchise RB, franchise TE; Johnson pushes Chambers to a very decent #2 (which is better suited to his possession reciever) and Vincent Jackson to #3. This gives Rivers perhaps the best set of weapons in the NFL. This could be the type of offense to get the Chargers over their final hurdles (Jacksonville, Indianapolis and New England) - all of which have excellent defenses. This would also free up the substantial money invested in Johnson in future years. Being on a legitimate playoff team (and a team with a very good defense), Johnson will be very happy. Johnson is 30, so there is still gas in tank.


San Diego trades Quentin Jammer to NY Giants

I know Jammer is under contract until 2012, but it is also clear their front office wants to revamp the position. Jammer is a very solid cover CB, but he isn't a ball hawk; It is very clear in recent drafts that the Chargers want Ballhawk CBs. With the emergence of Cromartie and bringing in Cason, the Chargers have a pair of quality ballhawk CBs. Plus they have alot of talented youngers behind them including Paul Oliver and DeJuan Tribble. This would also free up the considerable money invested in Jammer in future years. Jammer is an ideal fit for Spagnuolo's system. At 29 Jammer still has plenty of gas in the tank.

Note: additional players and/or minor draft picks may be needed
avatar
Big_Pete
Giants Legend
Giants Legend


View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Speculation - what would it take to trade Shockey?

Post  deranged on Thu Jul 03, 2008 1:23 pm

Right now, I wouldn't call Shockey good for any clubhouse.

Sadly, he's staying. Like it or not.

deranged
mascot
mascot


View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Speculation - what would it take to trade Shockey?

Post  Big_Pete on Sat Jul 05, 2008 8:32 pm

I don't agree, I think for a team that has had a consitently poor record in recent years; then Shockey will add enthusiasm and attitude that is poorly needed. That can be be infectious and produce results.

I think he would be great for a team like Miami, Atlanta, Cincinnati etc
avatar
Big_Pete
Giants Legend
Giants Legend


View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Speculation - what would it take to trade Shockey?

Post  Big_Pete on Sat Jul 05, 2008 8:37 pm

hmm, I wonder if we could trade Shockey for Ronnie Brown (possibly with another player/pick)

Brown, Jacobs and Bradshaw would be a lethal backfield rotation

Jacobs and Brown have shared a backfield before (also with Caddilac Williams)
avatar
Big_Pete
Giants Legend
Giants Legend


View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Speculation - what would it take to trade Shockey?

Post  56 Crazed Dogs on Sat Jul 05, 2008 8:55 pm

Brown and Williams were the reason that Jacobs left Auburn. I see no reason for the Giants to aquire Brown. I'm just as confident with Droughns.
avatar
56 Crazed Dogs
Hall of Famer
Hall of Famer


View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Speculation - what would it take to trade Shockey?

Post  Big_Pete on Sat Jul 05, 2008 11:09 pm

Admin wrote:Brown and Williams were the reason that Jacobs left Auburn. I see no reason for the Giants to aquire Brown. I'm just as confident with Droughns.

I am not sure Droughns will make the roster; he is a short yardage RB at best.

Considering we use a power running game it makes sense using rotation between Jacobs and Brown with Bradshaw for a chance of pace.


But that is just my opinion, it is a slow day after all. Smile
avatar
Big_Pete
Giants Legend
Giants Legend


View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Speculation - what would it take to trade Shockey?

Post  Big_Pete on Sun Jul 06, 2008 7:33 pm

Perhaps an option may be to trade Shockey for Marques Colston straight up?

The Saints have been reluctant to extend Colston and he is scheduled to become an RFA after the season

Shockey could easily fill a similar role accross the middle for the saints and improve their running game as well.


from http://www.nola.com/saints/t-p/index.ssf?/base/sports-4/1215322860206870.xml&coll=1&thispage=1


No worries: Colston, Evans deals to come

Sunday, July 06, 2008

With less than three weeks remaining before the start of training camp, no new contract extensions appear imminent for Saints receiver Marques Colston or guard Jahri Evans.

The team has had preliminary discussions with agents for the players, both of whom are set to become restricted free agents after this season. But unless things heat up in a hurry, I don't expect anything to get done this month.

Don't panic, though, Saints fans. I'll be shocked if they don't work out deals with both players at some point, this year or next.

True, the NFL is a business, and great players become financial casualties all the time. But this team has an excellent track record of identifying and rewarding its most valuable players -- and Colston and Evans certainly qualify.

In fact, if I had to rank the Saints' most irreplaceable players heading into this season and beyond, I'd put Colston in the top three, with quarterback Drew Brees and defensive end Will Smith, at least until Reggie Bush finally breaks through. And Evans probably fits somewhere near the top five.

Colston has continued to amaze me over the past year with his consistency -- not just on Sundays, but even in shorts and shells during summer practice sessions. He's a big-play receiver and a possession receiver, with as complete a combination of size, speed and reliable hands as any pass-catcher in the league. And while so many of the games' top wideouts seem to cause headaches off the field, the way Colston carries himself is refreshing.

It's harder to recognize everything Evans brings to the Saints' offense because he's an interior lineman, perhaps the least glamorous position on the field. But insiders were consistently praising him as the Saints' best talent up front toward the end of last season.

Most importantly, the Saints understand how integral these guys are, and they won't let them get away.

The negotiations, though, with these rising stars won't be as simple as they were with established veterans, such as defensive ends Will Smith and Charles Grant or tailback Deuce McAllister.

It's harder to determine the market for young guys like Colston and Evans, because as impressive as they've been so far, they still don't have lengthy track records. Colston's numbers compare favorably to top receivers like Chad Johnson, Reggie Wayne and Larry Fitzgerald, but he'll have a hard time demanding a similar contract.

Also, there isn't the same sense of urgency with these guys because they are only restricted free agents next year. The Saints will have the right to match any offer they receive, as long as they tender a one-year qualifying offer to the players. And depending on the size of that qualifying offer, other teams would be forced to surrender one or more top draft picks to the Saints to pry Colston or Evans away.

Both players might try and add an element of urgency to the negotiations by holding out at the start of training camp, but Saints General Manager Mickey Loomis has consistently taken a hard-line approach against that tactic, refusing to negotiate with players who hold out. Smith skipped the Saints' voluntary workout program and offseason training activities this offseason, but he showed up for the mandatory team minicamp.

Finally, the fact that Colston and Evans were both second-day draft picks could add a bit of emotional appeal to the negotiations. The players' agents will argue that they have been woefully underpaid to this point, and the Saints will argue that they're paying for the future, not the past.

Heading into the final year of their original contracts, Evans and Colston are both scheduled to earn $445,000 this season, a raise from $360,000 last year. At least both sides can agree that's an extraordinary bargain.

NO BIG DEAL: There's been no action in contract talks with the Saints' draft picks, but there's no rush. Whether those later-round deals come down to the wire, they're usually slotted in so tight that they practically work themselves out. First-round draft pick Sedrick Ellis could wind up missing a few days of training camp, which is the norm for a top pick like Ellis, who went seventh overall. So far, there's no reason to expect any serious roadblocks with his contract.

FOR A GOOD CAUSE: Colston's charity organization is holding an online auction to support neglected, abused and underprivileged children. The auction is open at www.colstoncharities.org.

BACK HOME: Peyton and Eli Manning will be in New Orleans this Thursday for an Oreo Double Stuff promotion at Isidore Newman School. They will have an Oreo "Lick Off," competing with 10 pairs of finalists selected through a national sweepstakes to see who can "twist, lick and dunk" the fastest for a chance to win $10,000. Parents Archie and Olivia will serve as grand marshals for the event.

What can I say? It's the NFL's slowest month. But the drought won't last much longer.
avatar
Big_Pete
Giants Legend
Giants Legend


View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Speculation - what would it take to trade Shockey?

Post  Big_Pete on Sun Jul 06, 2008 10:34 pm

another trade idea

NY Giants trade Shockey to Carolina


Carolina trades RB DeAngelo Williams to NY Giants
avatar
Big_Pete
Giants Legend
Giants Legend


View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Speculation - what would it take to trade Shockey?

Post  NYG Hampton 27 on Sun Jul 06, 2008 11:02 pm

Big_Pete wrote:another trade idea

NY Giants trade Shockey to Carolina


Carolina trades RB DeAngelo Williams to NY Giants
Jacobs, Bradshaw, and Ward. This would get rid of the best TE the Giants have had since Bavaro and would add another RB, no way.

The Colston idea in intriguing though Pete. Although I don't see WR as an immediate need, nor do I see Colston as equal to SHockey, but Colston and something might be something to consider.

Back to top Go down

Re: Speculation - what would it take to trade Shockey?

Post  Big_Pete on Mon Jul 07, 2008 7:27 am

I am just thowing ideas up

It seems that teams really covet their draft picks alot more than perhaps they should. (particularly as they often don't want to wait to let them develop).

So if Shockey is to be traded (either this year or next) it is more likely to be a player for player trade.

It is not thatI have anything too much against shockey, but I think the situation may have gone beyond the point of no return. I honestly think it is extremely unlikely that Shockey is a Giant in the 2009 season.


So far I like the Colston trade idea the most. I realise that WR isn't our top priority, but it is a position we can upgrade.

We have plenty of young WRs who are smaller with good speed; they are likely to develop

Colston is 6-4, 235; he has the great size that our other WRs lack.

2006 New Orleans Saints, 14 GP, 12 GS, 70 Rec, 1,038 yds, 14.8 average, 86T long, 8 TDs
2007 New Orleans Saints, 16 GP, 14 GS, 98 Rec, 1,202 yds, 12.3 average, 45 Long, 11 TD, 1 fumble

This is a guy who moves tha chains; what effect would this have on our offense

Remember New Orleans lacks other recieving weapons (outside of Bush) and doesn't have an effective running game.

How would he go with Plaxico? surely it would open up more opportunities for both. Also I think it would open up more oportunities for our other WRs, our TEs and our RBs.

If Eli has another reliable target teams won't be able to blanket Plaxico as much, particularly on third and long. I think it could help take Eli to the next level.


Anyways it is just an idea; we all know that the Saints are very interested in Shockey and I don't think they are willing to pay Colston the kind of money he deserves; perhaps it could be good for both teams.


perhaps next offseason after Toomer retires is more likely

here are some interesting facts about Colston I have found from espn insider

The Saints' Marques Colston is a possession receiver. Colston had 80 pass attempts against non-cornerbacks, a total that was second only to Wes Welker's 90 in that category. To put that total in better perspective, consider that Bobby Engram and T.J. Houshmandzadeh, two of the best possession receivers around, were the only others to top the 60 attempt mark in this category.
avatar
Big_Pete
Giants Legend
Giants Legend


View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Speculation - what would it take to trade Shockey?

Post  Big_Pete on Mon Jul 07, 2008 8:42 pm

another idea

what about trading Shockey to Tennessee for the rights to DT Albert Haynesworth?

Tennessee have been unable to get a long term deal, and there are previous character concerns (although these certainly seem to be in the past)

With the legitimate concerns around the Titans WRs group a young QB and the need for improved blocking, Shockey could be a real asset for the Titans offense.
avatar
Big_Pete
Giants Legend
Giants Legend


View user profile

Back to top Go down

Re: Speculation - what would it take to trade Shockey?

Post  Sponsored content


Sponsored content


Back to top Go down

View previous topic View next topic Back to top

- Similar topics

 
Permissions in this forum:
You cannot reply to topics in this forum